RE: February Reward Report
You are viewing a single comment's thread:
How about adding the token holders to the fan base, this will increase the rewards users make, plus give the account more curation rewards? Some of those users post daily, so it’ll maximise the benefits for both parties?
leofinance
vocup
reward
aliveandthriving
sportstalk
hive-engine
proofofbrain
waivio
vocup-token
ecency
0
0
0.000
Sounds like a bad idea.
Sounds like an upvote scheme based on bidbot, its very frown upon here on Hive, so wouldn't recommend it.
I’m not sure what bidbot is. Doesn’t seem like a ‘scheme’ merely a way to support token holders and increase revenue for the main account. We’ve already paid our dues, curation is the main way of earning for most on Hive (other than posting).
It will look like an upvote scheme, if you buy a token to get an upvote.
And abuse can be high in a system.
It will look like an upvote scheme to who? There's nothing against a token having a curator and voting for content. If you're really worried, don't make it automatic (although there's toold on hive for such a purpose) Manually curate token holers content. Still provides a bonus for the holders and helps the account earn...
To many of the OGs who came from Steemit and saw it first hand and what it did to the platform x)
This is why manual broad curators is highly praised here. Such as Acidyo for OCD.
If you buy votes either with hive/hbd directly or through a token it's frowned upon indeed. If you're buying curation in the token (i.e. you're not counting on getting hive rewards but rewards in said token, then that should be fine as long as it's not affecting L1 rewards).
For instance, if I pay you 100 l2 tokens, doesn't matter if you burn it or whatever, if that constitutes a Hive vote it's not acceptable.
Curation means curating based on the content, the author, etc, not cause you're getting something in return (other than curation rewards, engagement, follows, etc).
Yes, spot on. Way better at explaining it than I am :D
This is the exact system Ecency uses. So I'm unsure how you can say this is the rule yet allow a platform to do it 'because it's not all they do'. If you mean to say, it can be done, as long as there are checks and balances then that's fine. However it seems we're picking on certain select words and using those to formulate replies, it doesn't seem a productive way of moving forward.
Check the comments I linked to, I've tried getting them to stop that activity to no avail, they keep defending it saying they're checking to make sure it won't get abused, cherry on top is that they allow users to earn points based on delegations and then use those points to "request" upvotes on their content, content that is often borderline farmy if not often abused that goes unnoticed. Just cause I can't stop a big project from doing so doesn't mean I can't voice my concern on why new ones shouldn't follow in the same steps.
If anything this whole thing with ecency has given those looking to abuse this from the get-go an excuse and many grow quick and fast due to the greed of others not understanding why this means higher APR and not caring that it's taking rewards from everyone else who stays true to PoB and is happy with the APR they get from curation and HP rather than pushing it.
Yup, just caught up on the post you shared, thanks for sharing that. I do believe your interest is in leading Hive forward, sometimes these comments get missed and replied to out of order. Thanks again for sharing your views on the situation, I still believe we're in a similar position. As an 'OG' and as a 'Newbie' here on Hive.
Ah, of course, the good ole boys club!
Indeed, Manual curations should be highly favoured, and I believe Vocup answered the question perfectly.
Vocup did explain their accounts, but the voting schemes in generel
Yes, as you've said, the ole boys club disapprove.
What about things like buying an upvote from ecency...surely this would be just as, if not worse than these 'voting rings'?
Well, Ecency is doing manual curations and checks all post, but it depends on the curator so its not a bulletproof system.
Ecency do send all of the Hive earned by pointsale to Null.
Creating some sort of Hive sink.
It's been discussed with ecency and is only a small part of what they do, according to them they also make sure to check what the votes are being cast on, etc.
It's not an "old boys club" thing, it's a general community consensus as it strengthens proof of brain and curation in general, so that anyone can earn curation based on merit rather than based on how much they're willing to pay for it. It also disincentivizes those with stake to earn more than curation rewards so everyone earns the same APR.
Gotta love all the grey areas, it's ok for some but not others.
The 'ole boys club' was aimed at 'steemit OGs', had he said the community consensus I would have accepted that. I agree content should be curated based on the value it actually brings, something that is not universal over Hive, unfortunately.
My suggestion was based on there being checks and balances to avoid abuse, Vocup explained their positions perfectly, and a new suggestion was added,a manually curated posting, to help Vocup, and other Hive users. We all have to be open to discussions and moving forward, no point throwing everything back to 'the steemit OGs'. The future is forward, many Hivians don't even know what steemit is!
Yeah just not a fan personally of anything involving "exchange of tokens/hive" even if it just means prioritizing such users over others it still makes it unfair to everyone else.
And trust me I'm really not a fan of this kind of curation and have brought up the issue with ecency many times, not sure why they insist on keeping it going as it's one of the most use excused for others to do the same and often overdo it: https://peakd.com/hive-173737/@acidyo/re-mikezillo-rot5oj
I think we're both on the same side here to be honest, however as with anything crypto/money, people will always try to leverage it to their advantage. Thanks for taking the time to share your views.
Thank you very much for your suggestion and especially for taking the time to think about what might increase the token holders' revenue.
Unfortunately, creating such a fan base would be the complete opposite of the purpose of this account and the whole experiment. Let us explain why.
As we announced in our initial post our main goal is, "first and foremost" ... "to help new Hive members/bloggers and those with smaller accounts (in terms of Hive Power - staked Hive), regardless of whether they hold the token or not."
And we intend to keep it that way.
It also doesn't mean that we didn't, don't, or will not, from time to time, support a post from some more prominent blogger (who wouldn't fit in any of the above categories) if we find their article quality, interesting, or informative enough.
In the same way, from time to time, we have upvoted, we upvote, and we will upvote the posts or comments of VOCUP token holders, but solely as an occasional not-announced or even less promised bonus.
Apart from that, it's true, as you said, that some of our members post daily, but it's also true that some of them post only about one or two topics and (or) in a very stenciled style with just a couple of sentences difference from their previous or next post. And something like that is certainly not the type of content we would like to dedicate this account and the whole project to.
Furthermore, as we curate devotedly every day with maximal possible power (trying not to lower our voting power below 80% to keep the VP regeneration process within 24 hours), the only influencing factors affecting the shared revenue are the number of days in each month, our account's active HP, HIVE price fluctuation and eventual downvotes (of the articles that we upvote - what didn't happen so far.)
However, trying to observe the Hive blockchain in a broader and more distant future, we chose to dedicate this project to the search and support of new or newer, and "smaller" Hive members for the following reasons.
From our point of view, these are the two main factors that may help onboard more new members and, at the same time, help Hive to become truly decentralized. (This means the bigger amount of a bit bigger accounts (more or less equally sized) can provide a better and different spread of witness votes, proposals, etc., which directly may impact future development and the overall course of the whole blockchain by the will of the majority and not just by the will of several huge-power accounts that may easily outvote thousands and thousands very small ones.)
And in this regard, creating a fan base would be just creating another closed group, and it wouldn't help onboarding new members and even less creating solid and stabilized decentralization of the blockchain.
Anyway, we thank you for your interest, goodwill, and intention, and we hope that we managed to clarify a bit more the main purpose of this project!?!
!ALIVE
@slothlydoesit! You Are Alive so I just staked 0.1 $ALIVE to your account on behalf of @vocup. (9/20)
The tip has been paid for by the We Are Alive Tribe through the earnings on @alive.chat, feel free to swing by our daily chat any time you want.
Thanks for the detailed explanation, very valid points. Keep up the awesome curation and let's help push New users into the spotlight! How about a curation post to further spotlight these new users?
It sounds like a very good idea! Although besides finding and curating posts which are way more time consumable than it might seem, we are also doing some other work, slowly preparing future development(s) of the project, which work is not visible yet. So, it would be an additional task for us.
However, at the moment, we are not able to make the obligation of publishing such posts very often, but a couple of times per month, we can do that for sure.
Thank you for bringing this idea up! 😀
!PIZZA
Didn't read the whole comment but this part sounds great.
Thank you! Appreciated!
!PIZZA